As President Donald Trump deployed the National Guard in Washington, on Monday, a court hearing on the other side of the country shed new light on the administration’s drive to use the military in American cities — and some of the tensions at the heart of that effort.
On the witness stand in a federal courtroom in California, a longtime military leader testified that he expressed early resistance when federal immigration authorities wanted military support for a planned immigration operation in June in Los Angeles.
But when he voiced his opposition, a senior Customs and Border Patrol official rebuked him and questioned his “loyalty” to the nation, recalled Maj. Gen. Scott Sherman, who commanded Guard troops in Los Angeles.
It was a remarkable split screen. In L.A., the testimony from Sherman came as part of a three-day trial in which a judge will decide whether the administration’s use of the National Guard in that city broke the law. In D.C., Trump forged ahead with a new deployment — and even suggested that other Democrat-run cities like New York and Chicago could be next.
U.S. District Judge Charles Breyer, who is overseeing the L.A. trial, noted that his decision in the case could have implications for whether Trump is able to make similar deployments in other cities.
The trial’s first day of testimony centered largely on how the military provided support to immigration agents on the streets of Los Angeles and whether they were strictly adhering to legal limits on their ability to participate in law enforcement activity. Though the testimony from three witnesses — two military officials and an ICE supervisor — largely described a cautious and limited approach to the military’s role, there were revealing moments of tension within the administration.
Trump and Defense Secretary Pete Hegseth deployed 4,000 Guard troops to L.A. in June, and soon added 700 active duty Marines. Their purpose, according to Hegseth, was to protect federal buildings and flank ICE agents during immigration raids, some of which had been beset by unruly protests and violence.
But California Gov. Gavin Newsom says the troops have strayed from their mission, instead conducting civilian law enforcement in violation of an 1878 law known as the Posse Comitatus Act. That law was intended to prevent the president from turning the military on civilians without express approval from Congress.
The most revelatory testimony of the day came from Sherman, who initially commanded the Guard troops Trump deployed to Los Angeles. He recalled his opposition to a request by immigration authorities for military support during an operation slated for Father’s Day in the city’s MacArthur Park.
Intelligence, Sherman recalled, showed a minimal threat to federal immigration agents, and the proposed operation would have sent military vehicles through the center of the park. But when he expressed misgivings, Gregory Bovino, the chief patrol agent of the Customs and Border Patrol’s El Centro sector — who has taken on a leading rolein the Los Angeles immigration crackdown — pushed back strongly, Sherman recalled.
Asked by a lawyer for California if Bovino questioned Sherman’s loyalty to the U.S. over the issue, Sherman answered simply “yes” and did not elaborate.
The Trump administration objected to the testimony about loyalty, but Breyer overruled the objection, saying it was a notable window into the mindset of key decisionmakers.
A spokesperson for the Department of Homeland Security, which oversees ICE, declined to comment, calling questions about the exchange a “pathetic attempt to divide our law enforcement and our National Guard.”
Ultimately, after Sherman raised concerns, the operation was retooled, rescheduled for July 7 and approved by Hegseth.
In addition to the MacArthur Park deployment, dubbed “Operation Excalibur,” lawyers for California homed in on two other immigration operations and suggested that Guard troops were being called in by ICE to aid law enforcement even when their presence was not necessary. The other two operations took place at marijuana farms far from Los Angeles’ city center.
In a sign of the trial’s broader significance, the California lawyers also played a clip of Hegseth discussing the new D.C. deployment and comparing it to the mission in Los Angeles.
Since the L.A. deployment earlier this summer, Hegseth has since scaled back the National Guard presence in that city, though about 300 troops remain.
Sherman’s testimony followed a turn on the stand from William Harrington, deputy chief of staff of the Army and another commander of Task Force 51, the contingent of California’s Guard troops called by Trump and Hegseth into federal service.
Harrington testified that over two months of the deployment, the National Guard was asked for assistance 64 times.
On cross-examination by a Justice Department attorney, Harrington emphasized that he did not believe any National Guard troops had engaged directly in law enforcement activities that would violate the Posse Comitatus Act. But he also acknowledged that he was not present during any of the operations and was relying on reports from the field as well as watching portions of the operations on livestream.
Sherman testified that troops deployed in L.A. were trained that they could take actions against civilians if they felt there was a direct threat to either ICE agents or soldiers, or if they felt that the agents were being blocked from performing their immigration operations.
He also described an episode in which a veteran, seeking to access a VA facility, was detained by Marines after he walked through a checkpoint while wearing headphones. He said the Marines detained the man as a precaution and then waited for law enforcement to arrive to take over.
Breyer, a Clinton appointee, previously blocked the Guard deployment but was reversed by a unanimous appeals court panel. However, he has yet to rule on whether the administration’s deployment may have violated Posse Comitatus.
A ruling against Trump could result in restrictions on the military’s ability to operate in Los Angeles or even in other cities where Trump has deployed or is considering deploying troops. But Trump has greater control over the D.C. National Guard than the Guards of other states, and the Justice Department has long maintained that the D.C. Guard can be used for law enforcement purposes without violating the Posse Comitatus Act.
The trial is slated to continue through Wednesday.
